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Everybody has a Jesse Gilmore. Agency transformation coach and founder of Niche In Control. Author of the agency Owners Guide to Freedom and the creator of leverage for growth. I’m the host of the leverage for growth podcast, and I know that in order for you to scale your agency successfully, there are multiple shifts that need to happen within your mindset, skill set, and leadership style.
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I am on a mission to interview marketing and PR agency owners on their journey to six, seven and eight figures and leverage the lessons from their journey to save you time, energy, and money to get your agency to the next level. If you find value in these episodes, watch the case study video to learn more about leverage for growth and how we successfully scale agencies at niche and control economy assets that is niche in control.
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Dot com slash case study. And.
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You’re now listening to leverage for growth. Hey everybody. This is Jesse Gilmore, founder of Niche and Control and creator of leverage for growth. Welcome to the agency Leverage Edition. Today I’m very excited because I have, Laura is with me. She is the podcast host of the Paid Media Playbook and also the founder and president of double Z media.
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WP media is a high performance, media strategy agency helping busy marketing teams drive measurable results across digital, social and offline channels. Laura brings over two decades of experience in media strategy, audience segmentation, omni channel campaign execution before launching double Z. She held leadership roles in media buying and digital marketing, and today she’s built a team known for stretching every ad dollar, streamlining execution, and obsessing over KPIs.
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Her firm is trusted by meta, medium sized businesses and enterprise brands, not just for buying media, but for integrating data strategy and dynamic creative to change behavior and drive conversions. Today, Laura is going to walk us through how she built her agency from the ground up. Some of the biggest lessons that she’s learned on her journey and how she envisions the future.
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So, Laura, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me, Jesse. It’s great to be here. Yeah. Awesome. Let’s start from the beginning. Can you tell us a little bit about the history and background of your agency? Sure. Well, I started in. Well, first of all, I had worked for 20 years at another agency. And I knew I always knew I was going to do my own thing at some point, and it just was the right time.
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So, in January of 2020, of all the times to pick, I left and started my own agency and luckily did not get in office because, in March of 2020, we all know what happened. So, it was good, but most of my clients came with me from my old agency. I didn’t have a non-compete, so that was nice.
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And, and so, yeah, we just it just kind of took off, because I had these kind of built in clients, which is is great. Having built relationships over 25 years with various people in the industry. So networking is really important. I’ll tell you that. Yeah. So yeah, we’ve, we’ve had all kinds of you don’t clients, ecommerce, events, tourist attractions, travel, food.
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It’s really audience finding and, software, a lot of software. And coaching and coaching. Coaching.
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And kind of like it’s back to that that 2020. So you had some of those clients he had worked with before and they’re starting to work in your agency. What was kind of like the biggest difference that you noticed, especially in that way, beginning stage from being somebody that was working on and somebody else’s agency and then, starting to move into your own.
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What what do you think was the biggest difference, or, was it different? It was in the way of the, I guess, for lack. Well, one, you’re making more money when you’re working for someone else. You’re not making the same amount of money. So I realized how much. Yeah, I wasn’t making before. And then, So there’s that.
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I brought my my my right hand with me, too. So she and I started together, Lisa. And and so that was important for me to, to have that, support immediately. So I had an automatic staff and, those things were, I don’t know, we just had more freedom to where we were. I don’t want to compare to my old agency except to say I made we made our own rules.
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I got a lawyer that was great and helped me through, a business small business lawyer. Help me through the transition. And, if I had to give one piece of advice from starting off, it was make sure you get really good accounting firm, at the get go, because I had a lot of issues with, accounting in the beginning, simply because the people that I had hired were not the best.
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So, yeah, it took me a while to kind of get that ironed out, but, but yeah, now we’re oh my gosh, I’m going on six years. So, yeah, it’s been great though. And I got great clients and I don’t know, you can make it your own energy. The, the the agency is, is a reflection of you.
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Me now my mission my that I want to give my employees what I didn’t have, which was a lot of support and a work life balance and, benefits and a 401 K. So those are things that, I didn’t have all of those things at my other job, and I just want to, I don’t know, set a good example for.
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As an agency owner, as a women business owner, like I’m going to take care of, I can’t wait for my staff to get pregnant. Seriously, I’m excited. So anyway, yeah. So it’s just kind of it’s a different mentality. I think I it was a I was working for a boomer. I’m a Gen Xer. I feel like that from a Gen X perspective.
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We are more no be as straight to the point. Get it done. It’s just it’s a totally different mindset. Nobody’s trying to steal my business all the time. There’s just different mindsets. The there’s a it’s more collaborative with with the young, with younger my age and younger people tend to be more collaborative and less, I don’t know, parental information.
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They’re a silo. Yeah. Yeah. Like, yeah. It’s better to it’s better to share it. There’s enough clients to go around. So, it’s better to share information and and be transparent with each other. One of the most interesting things that you talked about is, you know, some of the things that you didn’t have to deal with when you’re an employee, such as trying to figure out how to do a 401 K or benefits for an employees or, figure out, you know, how can you take that leadership of what you have as a vision for the agency or the values that you have for the agency being able to bring it into the
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organization? And if you can think of like some of the did you go through like different workshops or different activities for that, or is it kind of more organic or how did it happen where you started out understanding like, this is the vision that I have for the agency being different than the previous one, and now I’m going to start acting on these, these things, or did it happen right from the get go?
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I think it happened right from the get go. I had I had always known what I wanted. I had I had had two weeks, I had gotten three weeks off when I had a baby and one week my pay was docked. So I really had two paid weeks of leave. So that that kind of stuff kind of sticks with you.
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And it’s I don’t want that resentment for anybody else. And I don’t want I just want to I want to give back, those things that I didn’t have and, I just and I hired wonderful people that are that I feel like, appreciate it, work their asses off and, are happy and aren’t going anywhere. So that’s that’s awesome.
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So I think it’s a win win when you treat your people and pay your people well. Yeah. They. Yeah, it’s a they stick around. Yeah. It’s a solid foundation because you had one of the cool things about your story so far, is that you had a vision for it, and you immediately went into enacting the vision right from the get go.
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I think a lot of times people get into entrepreneurship and they haven’t really like they might have a vision of like, I want to make more money. And then they start doing it. And then that’s like a different vision as opposed to something that seems a lot more, kind of like a neat or, value oriented, which is what you’re you’re talking.
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Yeah, absolutely. I feel like I definitely I mean, my agency that I was at before was fairly small. So I had done every job at that agency. At one point, I was there for almost 20, over 20 years. And so when you’ve done like the books, when you’ve done the, media buying and you’ve done creative and you’ve done you’ve worked on all of these different account manager and so it’s I had an idea of exactly what I wanted at this point.
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I mean, it was way past time for me to have gone out on my own. I as a single mom, I stayed a little too long, I would say in safe, in a safe like, oh, don’t take a chance. But it got to a point where I just felt like I’m going to die if I don’t leave. Yeah, yeah, I got to do this.
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I got to do this. And, So, yeah, don’t get to that point. Leave when you start to feel like you need to leave. That’s good advice for the young, younger folks. Yeah. And for the majority of the audience, they are agency owners and, and they’ve gotten to a place, whether it’s, six figures, seven figures, eight figures, at a certain point, amid sometimes that freedom aspect, it doesn’t really matter what the revenue actually is.
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The freedom aspect or the values aspect is something that, you know, could be an issue in an eight figure or nine figure type of business, too. So, if that’s true. Yeah. If you were to think about like if you were to look back at, kind of like the, the 5 or 6 years or so and you look at, the development of your team.
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So it’s just you and Lisa in the way beginning and now you have, a decent show. According to LinkedIn, I think it’s seven or so say. Yeah, yeah. My contractors. Yeah, I have contractors and I have two. So yeah, with that, with that kind of like that growth. What what are you what would you say are some of the biggest lessons that you learned either through, like the hiring of people that, you know, going through that process or, like training people to be able to do the work because, I know from a previous conversations you were able to go to, Europe with your daughter and like, yeah, it’s really
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cool, fun, fun experiences, because of that. So, yeah, I would say learn. I think I’ve learned. Well, like I said earlier, hire people smarter than you. Like Steve Jobs said, and, or at least people compliment you like, this is my skill set. This is yours. I think working with you, Jesse, has helped me a lot because I, we were able to put together a guidebook and, so that when I hired new people, it was measurable, and it was, it was transparent, like, here’s what you need to learn.
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Here’s when I expect you to learn it by. And so nobody was kind of flying blind. And in the beginning. Yeah. Was like that. So it took a couple of years to get that going. But once I did it was it is game changer. Because now I just feel like it’s a plug in that’s like operations feel pretty plug and play easy.
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It’s for for me it’s all business development now which is which is great. It’s just a whole different world. And talk a little bit about the paid media playbook. I was listening to a couple episodes right before this and yeah. Like what started the podcast. And how long have you had it. And I started the podcast as a way to kind of position myself as an expert in, in the industry, honestly.
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And, I got a lot of opinions. Jesse. Lisa and I, have a good kind of Ernie and Bert style. Connection. We’re so different, but. So we lend really well to each other in the podcast, and we have great conversations. She’s brilliant. And so together, it’s like I can always play the, like, the morning show host who’s kind of like, well, what does that mean?
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They every guy. And then she can be like the the nerdy numbers person. And so it’s just fun in that way. Like we were like that anyway. So we’re basically just talking on in the podcast. We’re just talking and I could talk forever really, once I get started. So, yeah, it was just a great experience and I’ve been able to bring in people that I’ve wanted to get to know better by having a podcast.
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I’m able to, like, have that meet and greet with them, get to know, build trust with them. And I love that. I mean, I’ve, I’ve met some great people. We’ve branched out from just paid media in with the playbook because I’m really targeting marketing directors at at companies, and because that’s who I want to find value in my podcast.
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And so I’m talking about creative. I’m talking about sponsorships. Any sort of issue that we might run into. And some of them are just interesting, like, people I kind of want to have, like, rando people on, too, just because I feel like most marketing directors are in this, like, age. They’re I’m just going to be like, because I work at demographics for for a living.
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Most, most, marketing directors are in this kind of my age range and a little bit younger. And so, yeah, just being able to talk about anything that our age finds relevant, whether it be music or dating apps, it’s it’s a combination. I don’t know, I think we just have a good chemistry, Lisa and I. So that’s why it’s working.
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And it’s been going on for a couple of years now. And, I’m getting good feedback from from people and so yeah, one thing I like about it. So we worked together for about three years, on, a lot of these kind of things and, and one of the things that’s really cool that you did with a client attraction.
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So, for anybody that’s like, do I actually have to launch a podcast in order for me to get in touch with media or marketing directors or. Yeah. Right. One thing that’s cool, what you did was you realize your personality is more based around relationships and networking, and then you found a medium or a client attraction strategy that matches that, talk, talk a little bit about, like, how did you kind of decide on the podcast, of doing that as opposed to maybe like cold email or some other type of, attraction method?
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I think, with the podcast, not only is it a great way to meet people and like I said, build trust, get get closer to people regardless. But also, yeah, it feels more natural then because I think, what, like, I think I’ve told you this, but like with media, I these people have to trust me with like $200,000, of budget, and I can’t, I can’t a cold email is not going to build that trust.
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It’s going to take a long time to to slowly get to that point where they’re going to be like, yeah, okay, I trust you with, our, our media budget. And so, if that’s a I’m not saying don’t do that. That’s just a this is much more this feels right. I’m able to like shine my personality and my humor.
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It seems to be the thing that draws people to me, my honesty. So I’m just appreciating, like, I have a medium and I like to sing and perform. So this is natural for me. I feel like. And I don’t want to sound cocky. I’m like, it’s fun. I think for anybody that’s listening right now and trying to figure out, you know, what is the best way of, of attracting the right clients.
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I think part of what Laura is talking about is the fact that you have to understand your personality of what you could do, like, you know, ongoing, regardless of what it is. And, and something that actually is, like, more natural or authentic. And, when we look at, client attraction in, I talked about medium sized businesses or enterprise brands.
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You’ve worked with all different types of companies. And when it comes to like paid media or media buying, what are the typical problems that people face that kind of lead them to needing, your, your type of service? I would say number one is, lack of, reporting and measurement, and not knowing how to do that properly.
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Attribution for the ads. It we have I subscribe to software, I subscribe to data. I have all the many different programs that I have to use to do that, and to make it transparent for the client to with dashboards. And those are things that a one company is not to invest in. You gotta have a lot of different, because you need so much different software and so, so many nowadays.
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It’s just like, yeah, you’ve got to be a really big company if you want to do your own media properly, because you need to buy all that stuff. And for me, it’s an economy of scale because I’m, I am able to do this for all these clients. So it justifies paying for these, place or I and these different big expensive programs that are 12 grand a year.
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15 grand. It’s it’s that’s what that’s the big difference of someone not wanting to do it themselves. Also just being in the silo, I think that a lot of marketing directors need to see what else is going on, and they need somebody to bounce things off of. I think with my my skill set, being a having a background of both creative digital and traditional, I have a lot of opinions, but I also know a lot of I have a lot of acumen, and I feel like I’m able to help marketing directors like all the time.
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Talk about our creative. Let’s walk. Walk through it, let’s test it, let’s I it takes somebody who’s really willing to tell a client, no, this isn’t I don’t think this is the way you should go. Don’t take orders from the client. Make sure you’re you’re being true to yourself. If they’re the client, at the end of the day, they’re going to do what they want to do.
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But you go on record as saying, I go on record as saying, well, I, I would start here, I would do this and kind of be more, yeah. I’m just honest. And, and if they’re creative socks, I will tell them, but I’ll make a suggestion. No, but seriously, like a billboard where a big billboard on the side of the road and they’re cramming everything in the world in it.
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I’m going to tell them, stop if can’t read that. So, yeah. And I can only imagine. And, obviously I’m not a, enterprise brand marketing director, but, I can imagine that the majority of them are trying to figure out what they can do with AI and then what they can do with more information and so forth.
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And, what I’ve noticed personally, and I want to hear your your thoughts on this is that, the experience that someone has in something allows them to have what someone consider to be discernment. So taking in the information and being able to say, like, is this actually valid or is this not valid? Is this something you want to, you know, move on or not?
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And I can only imagine that the 20 plus years that you have in media strategy gives you that type of discernment. So that when information comes in, you’re able to say, actually, I see where this is coming, but this is actually what what it is about. So that kind of leads leads me to think about the future of media.
00;21;22;00 – 00;21;41;21
You know, how do you see, media strategy there evolving or what you do for clients kind of evolving over the next 1 to 3 years, knowing that majority of them are going to be using AI in some form. And there might be things that are valid and things are not absolutely. We’ve been using AI in our software.
00;21;41;21 – 00;22;08;07
I mean, that’s what the algorithms are, to the point for, for many years, because we have to optimize that way and automatically optimize this often. So, but now everybody’s able to do that when I can go in and say, put a media plan together and give me all the different ideas and what are my KPIs and but, but it’s totally it’s just it is kind of one dimensional.
00;22;08;09 – 00;22;36;12
It is and we all know garbage in, garbage out. So we don’t know. I’m always asking, where did you get this? Where did you get this? Where did you get this? Sources. Source of sources, please. And, but I think at least for me and the way our agency works is being able to explain it to the client because AI is only going to give you, like, this kind of cookie cutter thing.
00;22;36;12 – 00;23;03;16
And everybody has every brand is different, every audience is different. And so I would say and also being able to give advice based on creative, based on being in a certain location, I mean, there’s so many things to take into consideration that, I mean, you’d have to feed a lot of stuff into AI and you still wouldn’t have that human like creative side either.
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That part that I’m, I feel like helps us stand out from basic digital marketing where they’re like, well, let me plug this in and get the metrics back. Now, how does this all work together? I think the funnel is still, I mean, I just think we have to measure each, each piece along in that attribution and it takes we’re not there yet with AI.
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We’re definitely not there. And especially with creative. I mean, it’s never going to be, I’ll hearken back to that podcast that you had listened to earlier with Tyler, where it was just it’s not going to be that feeling that you get when you’re actually there. You AI is doing things as if they are there, but they’re not there in that moment.
00;23;50;22 – 00;24;18;02
They’re not experiencing and smelling and tasting and, and seeing the weird things that are happening that you would only notice if you were there. And that’s good creative. Is are those things that aren’t obvious that you’re like, oh yeah, I know her. She did do that. That’s cool. I know that because I did that. So, yeah, I would say that’s the, the, the, the glue that’s going to keep us working in marketing.
00;24;18;04 – 00;24;50;13
To some extent. I mean, I know that a lot of things are going to get more and more automated, but I think, has has anything made you less busy now? Like, I mean, I think it’s not going to open up a bunch of it’s just going to give you more shit to do. And so I feel like and so we’re always going to be needed because, I mean, marketing directors don’t have time to do it all, and they’re not going to sit there and plug their entire job into AI and just what I mean, like, and it wouldn’t even make sense.
00;24;50;18 – 00;25;30;04
So yeah, I think we’ve got the like I said, everybody’s too busy to do everything themselves. Well yeah I think it’s, there’s a weird paradox in where AI is supposed to save and time, but it makes you, just work more and have to spend more time discerning is as accurate or as it’s not accurate. And in either previous podcasts that have either been on or within this one, I’ve talked a lot about how agency is over the next 3 to 5 years will end up splitting between execution oriented, which is the lowest cost kind of thing, and then more based around the strategy side.
00;25;30;07 – 00;25;57;16
And I see that, based on the foundation that you’ve been talking about, the podcast, which ultimately is is two different things, one authority base. And then also how AI does searches is based around podcast. So you being on the podcast is going to help your AI search thing. But at the same time you’re also interviewing people about paid media and being a part of that within the network, which allows you to be able to have that discernment that is needed.
00;25;57;19 – 00;26;20;18
And so I can see, the strategy of paid media being actually the increase of demand, like the demand is going to continue to increase as more people have, the information from like a mediocre, average. And so. Right. You’re positioning it. Yeah. I feel like you got to be as well-rounded as possible, at this point.
00;26;20;18 – 00;26;46;10
And I’m not saying don’t specialize, but like you said, I think strategy is unique to each to each client. So, it’s got to you’ve got to have that discernment over years of years and years of like, oh, no, I’ve seen this because I’ve seen I mean, I did, I did a, some basic math basically to figure out return on ad spend for a client recently.
00;26;46;13 – 00;27;04;28
And I had it figure out in chat, like I went in there and I was like, okay, here’s all the information. And they gave it back and it did it wrong and it figured it out wrong. It did the math wrong. Like, I thought that would be the one thing that they could do right. Would be like math because it’s finite.
00;27;05;00 – 00;27;32;04
But no. So I mean, it came and it really interpreted it, even though I had it just so obvious it screwed it up. I sent it off, client caught it, and I’m like, fuck, this sucks. Okay, I see, good. But, yeah. So I, I learned like, yeah, just you really do the second guessing second guesses as much as possible because that was embarrassing.
00;27;32;04 – 00;27;52;23
And that was just like a week ago. So another lesson. Yeah. Yeah. We’re never stop. And I, we’re going to keep we’re going to keep learning a lot of things I mean but it is super freaking helpful to well, to be clear, sometimes I feel like, gosh, just give me something to edit. I don’t want I have to.
00;27;52;25 – 00;28;11;27
Yeah. So that’s nice. So, if we were to, to kind of wrap this up into a couple different lessons and then, I’ll open it up to, anybody that wants to get in touch with you. But, some of the main lessons that I’ve captured so far, is, first off, hire really good people.
00;28;12;00 – 00;28;44;00
Right from the get go, treat them really well. Based around not just like, being nice to them or paying them a bunch, but actually, like, taking care of them, focusing on benefits and the actual work life balance piece. Another piece was based around client attraction and the way that you get clients, you need to both match the personality, but also, you know, like your personality and match, what they need in order for them to be able to trust you with, especially with media buying money.
00;28;44;02 – 00;29;02;15
Aside from from those, is there any other kind of lessons, like if you were to, to talk to your previous version of yourself and say, like, you know, here’s 1 or 2 things that you should do or shouldn’t do, to get you to save either time, energy or money? Is there anything else that you would that you would say?
00;29;02;18 – 00;29;30;21
I would say, get in touch early with your, I’m going to speed. This is, I think, men and women. But for me, I like the intuition, the feeling that you get when you’re making choices and you get a feeling in your physical body about, like, what you should do, listen to that. Like, don’t, don’t do you have to have that integrity with yourself, being true to yourself.
00;29;30;23 – 00;29;51;12
So, and when you start getting horrible, like toxic feelings about anything, you’ve got it. You’ve got to listen to that. That matters. So I would say, don’t you don’t have to grin and bear it forever. You can you can make a change. And I know this is like what every old person says to young people, but like, freaking do it.
00;29;51;14 – 00;30;10;21
Go do it. Don’t worry about it. Stop being afraid and just do it because it sure is going to happen. No matter what bad shit is going to happen whether you want it to or not. So just do it. Yes, you’re going to deal with it, but you’re going to deal with other bad shit if you did this, if you stayed the way it was.
00;30;10;21 – 00;30;44;26
So I’m just yeah, kind of babbling here, but that’s the truth. That would be the one major thing I would say. Yeah. And, I would say, don’t burn bridges like I remember when I really quick, when I first started, I had, was working for a guy who was he kind of, ruled a little bit with fear and anger with our partners and our vendors and on our client’s behalf, but just that he put the fear in people.
00;30;44;26 – 00;31;17;23
And so everybody was trying to please him. And I, I just I, I ended up learning from him like, I’ve got to be tough. And, and I realized how, how quickly, first of all, as a young woman, that doesn’t fucking work. You’re just a horrible bitch. And then but versus the old guy, and but then also now I quickly realized that’s bad because I had a lot of people to give me feedback about him.
00;31;17;23 – 00;31;43;25
And I’m like, okay, this isn’t working for anybody. So that’s why I’m talking about being collaborative and. They’ll they’ll work harder for you. Your vendors will work harder for you if you’re not bullying them. It works in the beginning. They want to please you in the beginning. But over time, I’m so glad that I kept the relationships I have because I have just an amazing network.
00;31;43;27 – 00;32;05;09
And, because I, I chose to take take a slightly higher road. I hate to sound braggy, but I’m proud of myself for that. Yeah, this is really cool because, if I was to tie it all together in the beginning, had a vision for the agency, that was different from what you had in the past.
00;32;05;12 – 00;32;33;17
You didn’t wait at all. Right? From the get go, you start bringing that vision into double Z. Then from double Z, you’re able to, grow the team, get them to align to your values. And even as you’re talking about, you know, some of the things where there’s like this balance between the way that you feel about how you show up or, you know, how you need to act as a leader, is really based around that values component that we talked about in the beginning.
00;32;33;17 – 00;32;56;17
So, very, very cool how it continues to, to be, kind of like stable and core to, how you operate now and then also how your organization is. So. Yeah. Thank you, if any. Thank you. Yeah. So if anybody is, is listening to this and they want to learn more about either double Z or connect with you, what’s the best way for them to do that?
00;32;56;19 – 00;33;26;24
Well, you can find me on LinkedIn. And I would say, Jesse, you probably have something listed because I can’t really. I’m not going to spell my name here. Yeah, I have a very strange last name as Xerxes pronounces. But if we were in Poland, it would be shish. So anyway, just saying, double Z Medium.com is a great way because it’s easier to spell, and then LinkedIn.
00;33;26;24 – 00;34;05;04
Laura Dot says, I think is my at LinkedIn. And then, yeah, Laura at double Z media.com or my cell phone. No, I’m just kidding. So they have our weekly. Yeah. So yeah, we’re we’re doing, we’re doing a scorecard right now. So, basically, we meet with you for half hour, and we gather some information and come back and talk and give you a scorecard of things that how we feel are, I mean, it’s it’s positive it’ll be coming from a positive place, I promise.
00;34;05;06 – 00;34;29;28
But maybe there’s room for growth here, and maybe there’s, Or this is something maybe you’re spending too much money on. You could be saving lots of little morsels. Seem to be, gotten unfriendly to my clients. They’re like, this is this is this was worth it. So. Yeah. Awesome. For anybody that is listening, they want to get in touch with Laura.
00;34;29;28 – 00;34;50;10
I’ll include all the links in, in the show highlights below, including the scorecard. So for paid media, if you’re doing paid media right now and you’re trying to figure out how to optimize it, the, the, the paid media scorecard is, another thing, I’ll add it to the show notes. So, Laura, I just want to say thank you so much for being on the show.
00;34;50;12 – 00;35;11;18
And, yeah, I appreciate it. Thank you Jesse. Thanks, everyone. Agency owners, if you want to transform your agency to sustain and grow without your direct involvement, where you can stop working in the business and start working on the business where you can free up your time, delegate, work more effectively, price and position your services to finally get paid for what you’re worth, and have the team run the day to day.
00;35;11;19 – 00;35;29;25
Go to nicheincontrol.com/case study now to learn more about leverage for growth, and also to book a free strategy session with us. We’ll look at your systems, determine exactly what you need to do in order for you to scale this year, and to create a strategic plan so that you can live the life of entrepreneurship you’ve always dreamed about.
00;35;29;27 – 00;36;24;23
Go to nicheincontrol.com/case study. Now.
